Comments on 'A Lament for F1' on F1 Insight

Comment by Clive

22/10/2009 17:46:05

Testing.

Comment by Roger Carballo AKA Architrion

22/10/2009 19:26:27

Absolutely agree with you, Clive. Absolutely. You have said it all, except one single thing. We, diehard fans, are guilty till a point. I explain. Do we need that kind of polls about how funny was a race, like Keith have after each grand prix? I have ever found interesting each single race I've seen. Of course, there are funny races, intriguing races, crazy races, and other not so interesting. But I've never found myself turning off the TV or looking for something better to do. There is always something that keeps me over F1 once and again and again... So, I'm with you. I don't need more action, crashes, overtakings and glamour. All I need is racing, technical perfection, the best driving around and competitiveness. The rest of the package, please, send it to Max, Bernie and co, so they can have a leathered-nazi girls party.

Comment by patrick

22/10/2009 19:36:25

well said. I've nothing more to add.

Comment by Clive

22/10/2009 21:40:56

Roger: You are right, we must shoulder much of the blame for the current state of F1. We thought that increasing viewer figures was a good sign and did not see how this would lead to a slavish worship of numbers that warps F1 into something other than it was intended to be. But it is not too late to return to racing as a sport and to refuse to change things merely to attract more viewers. F1 is watchable just as it has always been and we do not need artificial restraints and systems to "spice it up".

Comment by Clive

22/10/2009 21:44:17

Patrick: Approval from your good self is praise that I value highly.

Comment by Lonny

23/10/2009 02:15:56

I too have followed F1 for well over 40 years. The first race I ever saw was Spa and the sight of 1.5 liter F1 cars racing through the trees on public roads was life changing. Unfortunately one of my heroes, Colin Chapman started us down the road to perdition by seeking sponsors for his Lotus 49s. Now as long as people like Bernie control F1 the show is all that matters. He may give lip service to his "love" of the sport, but his actions show his real love is cash, everything else be damned. I fear if Chapman showed up today with a car as superior as the 79, it would be quickly banned. I think asking Merc to reduce the power of their engine is the death knell of F1 as we have known and loved it. Spec racing is here. The only ray of hope I see is that as NASCAR has standardized their cars and drivers, the ratings and live attendance have been steadily dropping. Perhaps someone will realize the personalities of men like Foyt, Hill, Moss etc and the variety of equipment of the 50s, 60s and 70s were the most interesting parts and find a way back. But I doubt it.

Comment by Clive

23/10/2009 02:30:13

Lonny: I can remember the shock at seeing a Lotus in a sponsor's colors for the first time and it still seems right to me that Lotuses should be green with yellow wheels. But the years have made such views seem antiquated and it is too easy to be seduced by such excellent color schemes as the John Player Special's and Brabham's Parmalat blue and white. Even so, you are correct - that was the moment when F1 started on the road to selling its soul. We may never get back to the purity and innocence of those days but the important thing is that we try. In striving for the simplicity of yesteryear, we cannot do anything but good for the sport. The dip in popularity of NASCAR is indeed interesting but the problem is that open wheel racing is in no position to take advantage of such a trend. I fear that motor sport in general loses supporters, not just NASCAR.

Comment by Guilherme Teixeira

23/10/2009 13:01:32

Clive, absolutely fantastic... surely one of the best pieces I've ever read about Formula One. I share the same point of view as Roger - I love F1 as it is, and I've been watching it for less then 25% of the time you have been (began watching it in 1998). Although the only F1 I remember is that Schumacher's reign, I never felt we need more close action, more overtakings, more "entertainment". But I tend to disagree with Lotus' search for sponsorship being the beginning of F1 damnation. I believe it was selling it for Bernie and CVC. All they want is to make money, and for that they seek high artificial entertainment levels or someone rich enough to take F1 to a place without a single drop of tradition. FIA (read: Max) had their fair share of guilt in this subject too. Not only because they sold it as if it were a object, but this technical restrictiveness (such as engine freeze) let people to think it was getting boring (due to the aerodynamics evolution, which is engine-freeze fault) and something needed to be done. And I can't picture a better prospect... Sad.

Comment by donwatters

23/10/2009 13:36:24

Far and away your best post ever, Clive. I've been an F1 fan since the early 60's and your concise and insightful review of the sport is absolutely spot on. Have the money-grubbing suits (Max, Bernie & CVC) ruined the sport? Probably. Is there a workable cure? Probably not. I hate to sound so negative, but I just don't see the sport turning around from its drive towards stanardization and boring sameness that is the spec series mindset. All us old guys can do is constantly remind ourselves and others of how glorious the sport used to be and reminese about the glory days of Gran Prix racing. To that end, I make it a habit to watch the movie "Gran Prix" at least 4 times a year. Ah yes, those indeed were the days.

Comment by verasaki

23/10/2009 15:35:29

True from start to finish. I'm afraid my die-hard status has been losing it's pulse in the last few years. The news I saw first thing this am as I pulled up the BBC front page just makes this post that much more sad. Todt: how does that song go? Meet the new boss, same as the old boss? I'm not exactly hopeful.

Comment by The Tru7h

23/10/2009 21:23:26

The Mosley era continues. What a tragedy.

Comment by Gusto

24/10/2009 13:57:34

F1 turning into NASCAR. Clive, now your scaring me, I`d rather F1 dies a respectable death now than go down that road. Another excellent article Clive, when you gonna write an F1 book.

Comment by Nick Goodspeed

24/10/2009 15:10:33

Fi will have to return to respectability before it's demise if it is to die a respectable death and I doubt very much this is going to happen with a Mosley puppet at the helm. I judge by Ecclestone's comments on Brawn's salary politics that he (Ecclestone) is feeling every bit as cocksure about as his position post Mosley as during. He obviously knows there is no reason to feel out a new president who was previously playing a major part in a company he successfully bribed. Elections aren't what they once were.

Comment by Journeyer

24/10/2009 23:01:54

The sad thing now is that F1 has become so dependent on commercial interests, that if fans lose interest and leave, then the sponsors might go too. Teams lose funding, and the sport may die. But I disagree that TV ratings aren't the measure of F1's success. Really, who decides whether the championship has any value or not? It's the fans who watch. If there's no one watching, does the championship have any value? The more fans watch, the more people agree that the championship has value, and therefore the more fans, the better it is for F1. If auto racing wasn't popular in the start, it could easily have been banned (too dangerous, people get killed) and it wouldn't be around today. Ultimately, it's the fans that explain why it's alive and kicking today. As for Todt, Joe Saward says he intends to hire someone who hasn't been involved in F1 previously as commissioner - agreeing in principle with what Jackie Stewart has said for some time. It's a start.

Comment by Journeyer

24/10/2009 23:04:45

Ultimately, will the true fans depart? It could've easily happened this year, more so than previous years. We've complained, we've ranted, but ultimately, we've stayed. It has always been thus and it probably always will be.

Comment by Nick Goodspeed

25/10/2009 15:23:33

Journeyer: In the begin people raced on public roads. Getting together on race tracks was seen as a step forward from risking the average drivers safety. If car racing is banned it will become a huge underground sport. Human nature is, after all human nature. The idea of the media or the manufacturers leaving, being the end of it all is ridiculous. It is basically the modern modus operandi used by the media to instill fear and raise awareness to sway the public. No matter what the greedy fools and incompetents do, they will not succeed in filtering out the car nuts of the world. If they had a recipe for this they would be part of a much higher echelon of control and propaganda.

Comment by Journeyer

25/10/2009 15:49:31

Exactly my point, Nick - car racing wasn't banned (and became what it is now) because of the fans. Therefore, the fans come first and foremost here - they decide ultimately what value a championship has. Also, the sponsors will leave only if the fans leave first. You may have misread my message a bit.

Comment by Nick Goodspeed

25/10/2009 17:20:47

I think the fear is that the TV bean counters read the viewer ratings as a sign that fans are lapping up F1 as a virtual sport / soap opera and pump more Coronation Street shenanigans into the circus. The electing of Todt is a sign that who ever is in charge has a different agenda than is being voiced. The idea that anyone from Ferrari, specially the Schumacher period of Ferrari, should be president is ludicrous. No one with an inkling of what fair play is all about could have lasted anytime at all under that regime and to think that one of the ring leaders is now top man is a sign of what is to come. In some ways this is the sleaziest thing to happen in F1 yet and Mosley's crap is a hard act to follow. still, the cars go round and round....

Comment by Fractal

26/10/2009 18:44:27

Well said sir. Wonderful. ... Whilst there is racing, there will be fans. AFC

Comment by Nick Goodspeed

27/10/2009 17:20:00

I am starting to get the impression there will be a great disparity between the leaders and the tail-enders next season. I wonder if the 104% rule still applies or if the brain trust has thought better of it.

Comment by Journeyer

28/10/2009 09:50:41

Nick, 107% rule was abolished when oneshot quali was introduced in 2003. It hasn't been reinstated.

Comment by Nick Goodspeed

04/11/2009 19:16:24

Interesting Toyota's exodus comes soon after a Ferrari man becomes the president of F1.

Comment by Clive

04/11/2009 20:23:17

Nick: I doubt that Todt's election had much to do with Toyota's withdrawal actually. More likely is that the rumour regarding the team having one more year to win a race was true and, pretty obviously, they failed to do this. The company needs to save money and F1 has always been a huge drain on resources. Without success to justify their presence, Toyota had no reason to be in the game.

Comment by Nick Goodspeed

04/11/2009 21:12:48

I am certain that the antics that have gone on over the last number of years have been taken in to account by all three teams who have left. It is one thing to sign up for a fair fight, another completely to continue after it has been admitted publicly that the game is tilted. In retrospective it would seem as if Mercedes decision to buy Ilmore was an extremely sound move.

Comment by Nick Goodspeed

05/11/2009 03:48:39

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601079&sid=a5zmD.xbYcsk

Comment by David

05/11/2009 07:21:20

That’s more like it! Manufacturers entered the F1 arena to showcase their auto racing ability and thus promote their road cars - although in reality there is little comparison one to the other. The FIA’s rules increasingly forbid competition in way of engines, chassis, tires and design talent. There is only to weight-handicap the drivers and these clowns will have realized their spec. agenda. Competent management does not chase away the heavyweights in favour of a bunch of minnow wannabes, unless the ambition is to create a second class series - or the management are fools. Indeed, the FIA did exactly that - and few would argue they are qualified fools. As if that’s not enough for their tiny minds, they then dip into a little race manipulation to raise the excitement level. There are a minority of ignorant fans, and competitors, who gain excitement from such behavior, but rational people are not to be found amongst them - so they too will eventually drift away. So, it comes as no great surprise that the manufacturer’s walked - or is it more correct to say, they are walking? They spend a lot of money on marketing and employ some of the field’s brightest talent - only to be foiled by dictatorial stupidity. More logical avenues are available to them. No, don’t look to Todt for improvement, for he’s merely a replacement spoke in the established wheel.

Comment by Nick Goodspeed

05/11/2009 13:05:09

I'm in total agreement David. The fools have employed a confrontational manner while holding the little end of the stick. They have pushed the teams around and destroyed the credibility of the sport. Now they find themselves having lost three of their biggest drawing cards and their tire supplier. Todt, the latest fool, has been named captain of a sinking ship, a ship that has been pillaged by Ecclestone and Mosley. Mosley has conveniently blamed escalating costs but in truth what has happened is that he and Ecclestone have reduced the value of F1 to a point that it is no longer worth the price. Now we are left with two problems; Mercedes and Ferrari are to big for the rest and if they are to remain, they will need dumbing down. Mercedes may find themselves in a position where they are the only team left with factory backing, which will make them look like bullies. This may be their reason to go, as, by themselves they will have nothing to prove. Ferrari doesn't care if they end up as a big fish in a little bowl as long as they can come out on top. They struggled to keep up with the other big teams, needing under the table cash influxes to keep them on a par with the rest. When and if Mercedes and Renault go they will be the great problem. At this point Todt's position will most likely become untenable for obvious reasons. The fools have fouled the nest.

Comment by Nick Goodspeed

05/11/2009 15:01:46

I see the fool, Ecclestone, is freaking out and venting his displaced hostility on Silverstone. Hopefully they'll tell him to shove his £12 million per race tithe. Hopefully Montreal will do the same along with Germany. Hopefully this will bankrupt the greedy little scrooge.

Comment by David

05/11/2009 20:20:01

Bankrupt the gnome? Such a thing shouldn’t be too difficult - especially with Bernie’s self-destructive assistance. Big money contributors are deserting F1 by the day, leaving just the pittance minnows can afford. Significant sponsors tend to invest money wisely - which puts the new F1 out of contention. Dwindling audiences - Turkey in particular - suggests the public have already settled on genuine three ring circus’ in lieu of F1’s blatantly ersatz show. It’s a costly mistake to underestimate your audience’s intelligence - or judge them on personal standards either, especially when they are so sadly lacking. Bernie’s wife, Slavica doesn’t need an MBA to pluck 50% - and hopefully plus - from his chest of diminishing loot. http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23742289-f1-boss-bernie-ecclestone-pockets-15-per-cent-pay-rise-while-sport-loses-millions.do Mmmm - the clouds are clearing ... Contrary to the FIA’s latest assertions that costs drove the manufacturer’s away - was it not the manufacturers’ primary argument all season long that they did not want a budget cap, ie., they were free to spend what they wished? Indeed, birds of a feather stick together - so one should not expect the FIA’s resident propaganda/psychology clown to excel either.

Comment by Nick Goodspeed

06/11/2009 14:39:51

I wonder if Renault is keeping quiet until year's end in hope that Briatore gets reinstated, so they can sell the team to him? More doom forecasts from Canada: http://www.thestar.com/wheels/article/722104--is-formula-1-on-its-last-legs?bn=1

Comment by Gusto

07/11/2009 20:51:51

Remember Clive, We fight the good fight because We Know it is right, It`s always darkest before the dawn.

Comment by Madmin

01/12/2009 12:03:55

Just a test don't mind me

Comment by Nick Goodspeed

23/12/2009 03:50:44

Clive, how do you feel about Schumacher being backed by Brawn with Todt at Mosley's desk?

Comment by Ylan Marcel

27/01/2010 16:54:51

But Button goes to McLaren. Schumacher and Nico will be fight, as Button with Hamilton.

Comment by Chrisess

31/01/2010 21:51:52

Clive, I am sorry but I think it is ungracious of you not to let us know what is going on with the website, you have built a great deal of good will with your insight and I,for one, still check regularly to see if there is any news on what has clearly been the best forum on the interweby thing. A statement of intent is not too much to ask, surely? Chrisess

Comment by Clive

31/01/2010 22:48:06

Fair comment, Chrisess, and I would love to let everyone know what I intend to do with F1 Insight, if only I knew myself. I have been thinking about it ever since it became clear to me that I had nothing left to say (for the moment at least) but have reached no conclusion as yet. It may be that the new season rescues me but that remains to be seen. So my apologies, certainly, but no definite answers.

Comment by Peter

01/02/2010 00:44:51

Glad you are otherwise ok anyway Clive! Best wishes

Comment by Steve Ellis

06/02/2010 13:25:04

Clive I do hope you find your voice as I found this site to be particularly good. Best of health.

Comment by Journeyer

10/02/2010 03:13:32

Hey Clive, hope you're doing well. I'm a bit surprised you don't have much more to say, considering so much has been going on. Schumi's comeback, anywhere between 3-6 new/revised teams, and many more. Hope to hear from you soon. :)

Comment by john F

13/02/2010 23:08:23

clive, your insight is greatly needed right now. someone like you must straighten out the confusion of all this team movement. when i first heard about the leeway given to the new teams on the first three races i thought of what your take would be and i thought that you could explain these issues to all of us. you are missed my friend hope to hear from you soon

Comment by Lee

16/02/2010 16:40:49

Clive, What can we do the persuade you to blog again? I can send some Cadburys Cream eggs over if that will help ;-) I really miss the insights into f1 and the comments from the posters on here.

Comment by Mad

16/02/2010 16:42:36

Lee, I concur! C'mon Dad. ;)

Comment by Clive

16/02/2010 17:20:57

I am extremely grateful to those readers who have expressed their desire for me to continue this blog and I wish only that I could give a confident promise to resume posting. Over the weeks and months of silence I have struggled to regain enthusiasm for the project and am persuaded now that it is time to take up the keyboard again. Another problem now presents itself, however. During the off season, I have taken only a casual interest in the F1 world and am no longer conversant with the latest developments and stories. Until I have caught up with events, therefore, I doubt that I will have much to say. Which leads me to the thought that, for a while at least, I am going to rely heavily on input from my readers. For instance and in reply to Nick's question, I had not even thought about the interesting re-arrangement of the Schumacher/Todt/Brawn triumvirate until he pointed it out. From what I have heard of Todt's handling of his new position, however, it seems he is doing rather well and it may be that we are pleasantly surprised by his fairness in dealing with the sport. And now you can jump all over me and explain how wrong I am! Mind you, I never expected to hear myself saying those words either... I'll have a look around the scene in the next day or so and see if there's a post for me to write.

Comment by Nick G

17/02/2010 16:24:38

I have to agree with you Clive. So far, so good. I think the true test will be when the season gets underway and penalties start to be imposed. Hopefully we will notice the difference. Wouldn't it be interesting if Cosworth had something up their sleeve? Nick

Comment by Nick G

17/02/2010 16:25:33

Might we start the 2010 season under a new heading?

Comment by Clive

18/02/2010 00:15:49

Good point, Nick - I'll have a word with Mad about a re-design for the header. The performance of the Cosworth is one of the most interesting things (and there are many) about the new season. If it were to prove the equal of the Mercedes, that could be a big spanner in the works of our predictions and expectations.

Comment by verasaki

18/02/2010 18:18:04

Welcome back! I'm looking forward to being caught up. So far I've mostly been looking at the pictures. Maybe you could give us a particularly Insightful overview of all the new driver pairings and driver/team pairings. Todt may work out. What is the phrase "the proof in the pudding"? Maybe as head of the FIA his chief interest will be centered on the sport as much as his team dominating was his chief interest as team manager. It may be he'll end up being even handed. I'm not holding my breath, the position itself seems to corrupt absolutely, but...it could happen.

Comment by David

19/02/2010 00:12:08

Vera: Possibly, but the phrase - A leopard doesn’t change its spots - could equally apply. Whatever, it now seems likely we’ll be able to let Clive straighten it all out. To Clive - thank you! To all fellow disciples - hopefully an exciting 2010 season.

Comment by D Winn

19/02/2010 17:13:18

Great to see you are returning Clive, your blogs have been sorely missed. I even thought that you had maybe buried yourself in some run-off area ! It's good to see that my thoughts of a black flag have been greatly exaggerated ;)

Comment by Michael

19/02/2010 21:20:30

good to see you back, Clive. I've missed your blog over the last few months

Comment by David

21/02/2010 10:15:17

It’s comforting to see the FIA’s rule confusion has survived the new era’s promised, “understanding between the parties.” http://f1.gpupdate.net/en/formula-1-news/228603/us-f1-wishes-to-skip-four-races/ President Todt believes a three race failure to appear is allowed. US F1 believes failures to appear are allowed - but the number of failures allowed is not clear. The FIA maintains there is no allowance for failures to appear. The entertainment has already begun!

Comment by Nick G

07/03/2010 04:17:46

I think it odd that Todt has refused Stefan GP entrance as they would most likely be the closed to the pace of the others, having taken over from Toyota. I really don't understand why they would want anyone they could get to try and qualify for a GP. If they aren't quick enough, then tell them they're impeding the others and send them packing. I guess it's not that simple anymore now that Ecclestone's gouging all factions. I see Massa's already complaining about the speed differential.

Comment by David

08/03/2010 17:17:29

Indeed, and Massa is not alone in his concern. Add the new driver factor in too and this concern is justified - albeit not politically correct. Perhaps it’s time to reinstate the 107% qualifying rule, which could be applied to Q1. Since Bernie sorely needs to improve the show - and thus his profits - I don’t think we’ll see it happen, but introducing an ‘open’ apprenticeship program of this proportion to the purported ‘pinnacle of motor sport’ could well have an adverse affect - that understandably the FIA fail to see. Since US F1’s inability to appear at Bahrain has been known for some time, it is a little puzzling that Stephen was not allowed to replace them, for Bernie would surely welcome another world champion in a proven car - just to improve the show, don’t you know?

Comment by Arun Srini

11/03/2010 08:12:48

I am amazed on how you could be this quiet as the season is about to start within 24 hrs!..

Comment by Andrew

11/03/2010 13:31:55

Clive I can no longer hide my disappointment that you have seemingly ceased to write on this blog... it feels as though we are on the brink of one of the most interesting and exciting seasons to date and not a word from you. Disappointing to say the least, but ultimately your choice.

Comment by Nick G

11/03/2010 16:18:44

This is a shame...both the abandonment of this blog and the end of Formula Atlantic.

Comment by Nick G

11/03/2010 18:13:00

This too, is a shame...or a sham: "...it is rumoured that Red Bull has made an application to the FIA for its Renault engine to be upgraded in order to come closer to the performance development of the leading Mercedes." (http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=359945&FS=F1) Having to ask if it is might possibly be allowed to tweak an engine in what is supposed to be the highest echelon of racing is ludicrous. So, the FIA decides who the elite will be and who will be allowed to race for the championship. "Sorry Red Bull. We've decreed that it isn't your turn this year. We will make more money if you don't meddle with Schumacher and Ferrari at the moment."

Comment by David

11/03/2010 21:05:39

Nick: Hear, hear! I could have put it differently - but not any better! I think 'sham' is more correct - and sadly, increasingly so.